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	<title>Comments on: Saudi Cleric:  Adult Breastfeeding Allows for Mixing of Unrelated Sexes</title>
	<atom:link href="http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/</link>
	<description>Green and Natural Parenting for Eco-Friendly Families</description>
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		<title>By: University Diaries &#187; Tony Judt on Language</title>
		<link>http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/#comment-17030</link>
		<dc:creator>University Diaries &#187; Tony Judt on Language</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jul 2010 20:37:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ecochildsplay.com/?p=8055#comment-17030</guid>
		<description>[...] is how one blogger responds to this grotesquerie. I am certainly not an expert in Islamic law or religion, nor do I write this in order to contribute to the stereotypes propagated in the West [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] is how one blogger responds to this grotesquerie. I am certainly not an expert in Islamic law or religion, nor do I write this in order to contribute to the stereotypes propagated in the West [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jennifer Lance</title>
		<link>http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/#comment-17029</link>
		<dc:creator>Jennifer Lance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jul 2010 14:05:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ecochildsplay.com/?p=8055#comment-17029</guid>
		<description>@Umm Abdullah



Your comment is very informative. I am pleased the culture supports breastfeeding for two years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Umm Abdullah</p>
<p>Your comment is very informative. I am pleased the culture supports breastfeeding for two years.</p>
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		<title>By: Umm Abdullah</title>
		<link>http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/#comment-17028</link>
		<dc:creator>Umm Abdullah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jul 2010 07:21:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ecochildsplay.com/?p=8055#comment-17028</guid>
		<description>Just to answer some questions.....

Islamically, a child is ENTITLED to nurse for two years.  If a mother wants to wean she should have a legitimate reason for doing so and the husband must agree.  The husband is the one who is responsible to provide for the child and wife financially, and so if a mother cannot breastfeed or does not have enough milk then the father is responsible to pay a wetnurse.



Wetnurses ARE part of Islamic heritage, but the wetnurse needs to inform the people whom she has given milk to as they become &quot;milk brothers and sisters&quot; and are not allowed to marry.



Extended nursing (beyond two years) is not something that is encouraged.  Slightly, longer than two years is okay, but beyond that it is not advised.



Breastfeeding is very much part of the Islamic way of life but it is sad to note that many Muslim countries, post-colonization, have slipped into a pro-formula type notion. Very sad indeed, and a discerning correlation.



Also, the above mentioned fatwa is NOT a traditional idea, and most Muslim scholars would reject it outright.  If a woman took this approach (for whatever strange reason) then according to the majority opinion he would have to drink 5 times (not from the breast!!) and they would not be allowed to ever marry.



I think it is interesting that this non-mainstream fatwa is receiving media attention.  In Saudi Arabia most people are very much used to a gender segregated society and have no need for such fatwas.



Hope this info is useful to those of you who really want to know about the Islamic stance on breastfeeding.  =)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just to answer some questions&#8230;..</p>
<p>Islamically, a child is ENTITLED to nurse for two years.  If a mother wants to wean she should have a legitimate reason for doing so and the husband must agree.  The husband is the one who is responsible to provide for the child and wife financially, and so if a mother cannot breastfeed or does not have enough milk then the father is responsible to pay a wetnurse.</p>
<p>Wetnurses ARE part of Islamic heritage, but the wetnurse needs to inform the people whom she has given milk to as they become &#8220;milk brothers and sisters&#8221; and are not allowed to marry.</p>
<p>Extended nursing (beyond two years) is not something that is encouraged.  Slightly, longer than two years is okay, but beyond that it is not advised.</p>
<p>Breastfeeding is very much part of the Islamic way of life but it is sad to note that many Muslim countries, post-colonization, have slipped into a pro-formula type notion. Very sad indeed, and a discerning correlation.</p>
<p>Also, the above mentioned fatwa is NOT a traditional idea, and most Muslim scholars would reject it outright.  If a woman took this approach (for whatever strange reason) then according to the majority opinion he would have to drink 5 times (not from the breast!!) and they would not be allowed to ever marry.</p>
<p>I think it is interesting that this non-mainstream fatwa is receiving media attention.  In Saudi Arabia most people are very much used to a gender segregated society and have no need for such fatwas.</p>
<p>Hope this info is useful to those of you who really want to know about the Islamic stance on breastfeeding.  =)</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/#comment-17027</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Jul 2010 05:40:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ecochildsplay.com/?p=8055#comment-17027</guid>
		<description>I think you should also that into consideration that this is just one minority idea ... so we can&#039;t really think about &quot;Saudi&quot; or &quot;Islamic Law&quot; based upon one persons idea (which, by the way, has been rejected by almost all). Just a thought.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you should also that into consideration that this is just one minority idea &#8230; so we can&#8217;t really think about &#8220;Saudi&#8221; or &#8220;Islamic Law&#8221; based upon one persons idea (which, by the way, has been rejected by almost all). Just a thought.</p>
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		<title>By: Heather</title>
		<link>http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/#comment-17026</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jul 2010 18:36:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ecochildsplay.com/?p=8055#comment-17026</guid>
		<description>Thanks Panya... and yes, that raises another sociological issue... if their immediate family members can&#039;t marry each other, then if this practice were to become widespread (which, again, it doesn&#039;t seem that it will, but for argument&#039;s sake - ) it wouldn&#039;t be too long before the interconnectedness of all &#039;milk mothers&#039; and &#039;milk sons&#039; would mean that it would become very difficult to find anyone to marry at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Panya&#8230; and yes, that raises another sociological issue&#8230; if their immediate family members can&#8217;t marry each other, then if this practice were to become widespread (which, again, it doesn&#8217;t seem that it will, but for argument&#8217;s sake &#8211; ) it wouldn&#8217;t be too long before the interconnectedness of all &#8216;milk mothers&#8217; and &#8216;milk sons&#8217; would mean that it would become very difficult to find anyone to marry at all.</p>
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		<title>By: Jennifer Lance</title>
		<link>http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/#comment-17025</link>
		<dc:creator>Jennifer Lance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jul 2010 18:09:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ecochildsplay.com/?p=8055#comment-17025</guid>
		<description>Panya, thanks for the link.  It is an interesting read.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Panya, thanks for the link.  It is an interesting read.</p>
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		<title>By: Panya</title>
		<link>http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/#comment-17024</link>
		<dc:creator>Panya</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jul 2010 17:57:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ecochildsplay.com/?p=8055#comment-17024</guid>
		<description>Heather, wetnursing is common, yes. The woman and man would then be &quot;milk mother&quot; and &quot;milk son&quot; and would technically be related, therefore not only could they not marry, but their immediate family members couldn&#039;t marry either.



Susie at Susie&#039;s Big Adventure -- an American living in Saudi Arabia with her Saudi husband -- wrote an interesting post about this about a month ago:

http://susiesbigadventure.blogspot.com/2010/05/here-drink-this.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Heather, wetnursing is common, yes. The woman and man would then be &#8220;milk mother&#8221; and &#8220;milk son&#8221; and would technically be related, therefore not only could they not marry, but their immediate family members couldn&#8217;t marry either.</p>
<p>Susie at Susie&#8217;s Big Adventure &#8212; an American living in Saudi Arabia with her Saudi husband &#8212; wrote an interesting post about this about a month ago:</p>
<p><a href="http://susiesbigadventure.blogspot.com/2010/05/here-drink-this.html" rel="nofollow">http://susiesbigadventure.blogspot.com/2010/05/here-drink-this.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Jennifer Lance</title>
		<link>http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/#comment-17023</link>
		<dc:creator>Jennifer Lance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jul 2010 16:30:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ecochildsplay.com/?p=8055#comment-17023</guid>
		<description>@Heather, yes, interesting, and you raise even more interesting thoughts on the subject.  I debated about writing this post, as I don&#039;t to be sensationalizing things, but I did find it very interesting.

http://hadith.al-islam.com/bayan/tree.asp?Lang=eng&amp;ID=481

Found this from Kingdom of Saudi Arabia on wet nursing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Heather, yes, interesting, and you raise even more interesting thoughts on the subject.  I debated about writing this post, as I don&#8217;t to be sensationalizing things, but I did find it very interesting.</p>
<p><a href="http://hadith.al-islam.com/bayan/tree.asp?Lang=eng&#038;ID=481" rel="nofollow">http://hadith.al-islam.com/bayan/tree.asp?Lang=eng&#038;ID=481</a></p>
<p>Found this from Kingdom of Saudi Arabia on wet nursing.</p>
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		<title>By: Heather</title>
		<link>http://ecochildsplay.com/2010/07/05/saudi-cleric-adult-breastfeeding-allows-for-mixing-of-unrelated-sexes/#comment-17022</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jul 2010 16:23:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ecochildsplay.com/?p=8055#comment-17022</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s... interesting.  It doesn&#039;t sound like it&#039;s being perceived as violating any taboo about adults drinking human milk, which is interesting.  It&#039;s interesting that there are clerics trying to find &#039;loopholes&#039; like this in order to allow more societal contact between the genders, which is a sort of implicit acknowledgment that the rule of strict segregation is unreasonable, but that they&#039;re not yet ready to universally give it up.



It&#039;s interesting that there&#039;s disagreement about what defines a &quot;maternal relationship&quot;, as though having some milk is all there is to it -- I&#039;m curious if wetnursing is at all common in this culture.  I&#039;m also curious what the normal age of weaning would be, and what their perceptions of older children (ie, 4-6yo) nursing would be.  If they happen to frown on a 6yo nursing, then the argument in favour of allowing a grown man to nurse (either directly or from a cup) becomes... interesting.  If they wholeheartedly approve of natural weaning, then it&#039;s still... interesting... to draw that further conclusion.



The further consequences of this edict, if it were more fully adopted (which it sounds like it probably won&#039;t be), are also... interesting.  Once this &quot;maternal relationship&quot; is established, will the man have certain rights to the woman as a mother?  Does it give him family rights by extension, to the father as well?  Such as financial rights, or accommodation.   Would this relationship make it impossible for this man to at any point in the future take this woman as a wife, should she become &#039;available&#039; (I&#039;m not certain on the rules about widows re-marrying in this culture)?



It&#039;s all just very... interesting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s&#8230; interesting.  It doesn&#8217;t sound like it&#8217;s being perceived as violating any taboo about adults drinking human milk, which is interesting.  It&#8217;s interesting that there are clerics trying to find &#8216;loopholes&#8217; like this in order to allow more societal contact between the genders, which is a sort of implicit acknowledgment that the rule of strict segregation is unreasonable, but that they&#8217;re not yet ready to universally give it up.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s interesting that there&#8217;s disagreement about what defines a &#8220;maternal relationship&#8221;, as though having some milk is all there is to it &#8212; I&#8217;m curious if wetnursing is at all common in this culture.  I&#8217;m also curious what the normal age of weaning would be, and what their perceptions of older children (ie, 4-6yo) nursing would be.  If they happen to frown on a 6yo nursing, then the argument in favour of allowing a grown man to nurse (either directly or from a cup) becomes&#8230; interesting.  If they wholeheartedly approve of natural weaning, then it&#8217;s still&#8230; interesting&#8230; to draw that further conclusion.</p>
<p>The further consequences of this edict, if it were more fully adopted (which it sounds like it probably won&#8217;t be), are also&#8230; interesting.  Once this &#8220;maternal relationship&#8221; is established, will the man have certain rights to the woman as a mother?  Does it give him family rights by extension, to the father as well?  Such as financial rights, or accommodation.   Would this relationship make it impossible for this man to at any point in the future take this woman as a wife, should she become &#8216;available&#8217; (I&#8217;m not certain on the rules about widows re-marrying in this culture)?</p>
<p>It&#8217;s all just very&#8230; interesting.</p>
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